BGE Pulse Podcast: Patrick Roney, M.S. (G’24), Biostatistics Master’s Graduate and Ph.D. Student
On this episode of BGE Pulse, Patrick Roney (G’24) talks about his experience across multiple roles at Georgetown: as a master’s student and now as a research staff member and part-time Ph.D. student, all within the Department of Biostatistics, Bioinformatics & Biomathematics. Patrick discusses his current research on the effectiveness of precision medicine; his time working at Lombardi Comprehensive Cancer Center and the NIH National Heart, Lung, and Blood Institute; and his role in building community for biostatistics students.
Benjamin Nochimson: Hello and welcome to BGE Pulse, the show where we talk to members of Georgetown’s Biomedical Graduate Education community to learn more about them. This time, we’re talking to Patrick Roney. Patrick is a 2024 graduate with an M.S. in Biostatistics, and he’s currently working part time on his Ph.D. in Biostatistics while working full time as a staff biostatistician for Georgetown.
Please enjoy my conversation with Patrick.
Intro Music
Benjamin Nochimson: Why don’t we start with you, sort of introducing yourself, and explaining your journey. And what brought you to Georgetown. I saw, actually, that you got your B.S. from UVA. I’m a UVA grad also, so we’ve got that in common.
Patrick Roney: I met somebody else. We call ourselves ‘Wahooyas.’
Benjamin Nochimson: Oh, nice.
Patrick Roney: Sure, be happy to. So, yeah. So my name is Patrick. Yeah. So started out at UVA, where I had a research interest in weather effects on human health. And so I, I come at it from sort of the environmental science perspective. And what I sort of realized during that time was that I was getting more and more interested about how do we quantify sort of medical data and understand essentially who is going to be harmed by health, and also just for epidemiological factors as well.
So that led to me pursuing then, my master’s in biostatistics at Georgetown. At the time, again, just sort of knew I had this interest in numbers and human health. And Georgetown kind of helped me explore that, in a wide variety of ways. A couple of different projects, for instance, I’ve gotten to work on have been sort of … I was a global health fellow, during my master’s program in which we researched using World Health Organization tools to analyze childhood malnutrition. Which we just got published this year.
Benjamin Nochimson: Oh, congratulations.
Patrick Roney: Thank you. And then we also, during my master’s program just got also to explore sort of clinical applications. So getting to see, you know, different cancer treatments, whether or not they’re working or not working for different populations. And so I was able to kind of get to explore both sides of that. And now after finishing my master’s, I got hired at Georgetown as well to be a staff biostatistician.
And so now I get to wear two hats, as sort of the staff biostatistician, and I’m also a part time PhD student as well. So I get to sort of continue doing sort of my own research as far as now, looking at the clinical trial methodology, or how is it that we figure out whether or not a treatment’s actually effective?
And also getting to collaborate with a lot of different investigators at Georgetown, whether that’s in MedStar or whether that’s in sort of the more academia focus. Again, just been able to explore factors from whether a policy is effective at making equitable cancer treatment, access or, again, just trying to see whether or not treatments are working and just improve patient outcomes.
So I’ve been very lucky to kind of just go from having this idea of being interested in quantifying human health and getting to see all the different avenues it can take. Trying to do some good with it along the way.
Benjamin Nochimson: Excellent. Well, yeah, that’s great. That’s a great, you know, path and trajectory that you found. What, like what is your research focus nowadays with your part time PhD program that you’re doing?
Patrick Roney: Yeah. So now, so still just finishing the first year. So still, this could change tomorrow. Or next week.
But currently sort of thinking about trying to do something related to dynamic precision medicine, in which, sort of with conventional precision medicine, you take a look at the tumor, identify sort of what’s the dominant mutation that’s driving it. And you try to attack just that. And so this is investigating a different approach in which instead of just trying to target whatever is the largest or driving it the most, you try to see for which ones you can control, sort of, and then hopefully lead to better prognosis that you can sort of manage it rather than just trying to take it out and have it come back with a vengeance.
So we’re working on sort of things for quantifying whether or not this could work. And so that sort of involves trying to then models for tumor behavior. But then ultimately for my clinical trials interest, trying to actually see how would we be able to prove that this is actually significantly better than how precision medicine currently operates. And so that’s under, Bob Beckman.
From Georgetown. So, yeah, so that’s kind of where I’m thinking right now. But again, definitely, we’ll see. Hopefully, hopefully that’s the direction.
Benjamin Nochimson: Nice. Well yeah. You definitely you know you clearly got the time and space to you know make adjustments if need be. But it sounds really cool. Can you speak a little more about your interest in the quantification of medical data? Because it seems like that’s like a common theme for you. That’s something that you’re interested in, both like just abstractly, but also within like the actual work that you’ve been doing. Like what…and nowadays, you know, it seems that, you know, quantification of data of any kind is just becoming everything now. So can you speak a little bit about that?
Patrick Roney: Yeah, definitely. Yeah. I think it’s, it’s a really interesting, it’s of course important to have, you know, statistical literacy in general. Right? And I think it’s been a great thing that there’s been sort of this boom as far as people wanting to quantify things right. There’s of course ways that we have to do it appropriately to make sure, you know, we’re properly representing the data and the conclusions that come from it.
But I’d say for myself, I was always interested in, sort of math and science growing up. And then, my path got a little bit…like as far as sort of then when I first went on to UVA, I was like, well, I think I actually want to be an English major. So I was on like, you know, the student newspaper sort of went on a completely different path.
But I always think it was really good because I think part of it was that, for me, I knew I wanted to work on something applied. And so I had before thought I was a little theoretical. And so that started me honestly being able to see how it is that you can, you know, try to just sort of be grounded as far as the stories and getting to make an impact in journalism, which then I found my way back to a point to explore sort of math and get into research.
And so that sort of then drove me into kind of wanting to make sure that what I would do for hopefully a career would be able to then kind of take my interest in math and being able to make sure that I was making a positive difference on the world. So that’s why I think that this has sort of been a really happy meeting of all these different, you know, things that hopefully now looking back, I’m like, okay, I can kind of see, like, why did I do that? And how did it sort of lead to here?
But yeah, it’s been really great now to be able to kind of see and feel like, you know, I get to hopefully make a positive impact with the work I get to do in the questions I work with, and the people I get to work with as well, as far as, you know, enjoying the process of answering these questions as well.
But yeah, and then as far as, as far as the amount of data that’s out there, sometimes it is I feel like a little…it’s like there’s a lot of different conclusions. You know, it’s great as far as you know, there’s projects that come in that try to synthesize all that. Right? As far as doing a meta-analysis to say we’ve found like 100 papers, we’ve boiled it down to these 20.
We want to see whether or not they’re saying the same thing overall. So I think it’s really good that, you know, we’re doing also a good job at sort of looking back to see are there already patterns that we can have conclusions to improve outcomes right now? And also again, trying to make the questions to improve tomorrow as well.
Benjamin Nochimson: Nice. Yeah. I did a little bit of, LinkedIn snooping and I saw that you, have some AI interest, which, you know, like, it’s bound to come up. You know, AI’s always coming up nowadays, but, I guess it seems like this is the appropriate time to ask about that. Based on, you know, what AI can do with data.
So what, what has been the role of AI in, I guess biostatistics in general, but also your own work and what you think the future may hold for it?
Patrick Roney: Yeah. So I would definitely say that again, this is kind of I feel like the benefit of getting to work and be a student at the same time because I get, you know, from the student perspective, you know, there’s every, so for instance, I like to attend, there’s this organization called the American Statistical Association, which is this professional body in which they put on things, for instance, like webinars that specifically talk about you know, how is AI changing our practice?
Because I think, you know, there’s this thought about, right, you could just upload data into it. AI can produce something. Whether or not it’s right or not though, you know, I think it’s sort of the same thing as far as for everything, where technically you can upload something to it and it’s a matter of, you know, having the expertise and knowledge to figure out whether or not it sort of is worth anything, you know.
And I think that that’s sort of the biggest thing. So, for instance, I use AI in my work as far as to help with, just sort of being something to consider different for, for instance, for an analysis technique I’m not as familiar with, being able to get perspectives, you know, try to have it be a critic of me.
So I come up with sort of a data analysis plan. I sort of will write it up, and then I’ll talk about with my supervisor also, then share it with AI just to see sort of what holes already exist. And I figure if they can be found that easily, it’s a good thing I checked, and then I can make sure to, you know, beef it up.
Right? So I think that’s sort of one way to have it sort of be a double-checker. Definitely, as far as, you know, coding is a part of what we do as well. And so it’s useful sometimes to just be able to have…it’s pretty good at generating the code I need. And so again, it’s one of those things that ultimately you’re still the one that needs to create the plan and the one that needs to make sure that, you know, it’s not giving you garbage at the end of the day.
But it’s definitely something that can help speed things up as well. I mean, at the end of the day, it’s a tool, right? I think that’s the biggest thing about making sure that you know how to use the tool. And again, that it’s creating things that are actually useful and not just, you know, appearing to be useful.
But definitely I would say that, you know, also in the vein of trying to be AI-proof, which is something that I feel like, again, I don’t know that AI kind of suggests, as far as, you know, how do we..without getting….I feel like that could be a whole different conversation for us to have.
Benjamin Nochimson: Yeah.
Patrick Roney: You know, purpose of work and AI, but it’s definitely something that, you know, it’s ultimately, again, I’d say a tool that we can use to make things better for ourselves, but we have to know how to do it in the right way to make things better. So yeah, definitely it’s a balance though, and definitely need to have a grounding without AI, I think, in some ways, to make sure that you actually know what it’s talking about.
Because ultimately that still has to, I think come from a person.
Benjamin Nochimson: Yeah, definitely. I agree with you. You mentioned the ASA. Right? You founded the Georgetown chapter, is that right?
Patrick Roney: Yes. That’s right. Yeah. So it’s, it’s been great as far as a new initiative. So that’s a way for us like in our department. So it’s way for then master’s and Ph.D. students to kind of have a space. We just started this year. And so we try to meet once a month.
Benjamin Nochimson: And that’s called the American Statistical Association. Is that right?
Patrick Roney: Yeah. American Statistical Association. And then we’re the Georgetown University student chapter. Right. So I mean, sometimes it’s for…we’re looking in the future to kind of have it be, you know, an opportunity for people to get to talk about their research interests and be sort of just a ground, again, to expose people to new research ideas. But it’s also just a place to kind of have community.
As far as, you know, we had a pizza party and, you know, just have, you know, right before finals, you know, you just sometimes just need to have that little break as far as just to let yourself decompress and then get right back into it. And so, it’s been a really good start as far as being able to like and just have another opportunity to everybody come together, have some pizza, and just get to have some good conversations along the way.
So again, we’re a very studious bunch, but you know, you got to have some fun too.
Benjamin Nochimson: Definitely. Yeah, I totally agree. I, I am actually, for my program at Georgetown, I was the social chair last year, so I know all about throwing a pizza party.
Patrick Roney: Yeah, I’ll say, you know, like, sometimes I feel like these groups are hard. And then, you know, you try to organize, you know, an event for, you know, 20, 25 people and you’re like, all right, we got to get…So I’m also a part of the Washington Statistical Society, which is the local chapter for the ASA that we at Georgetown’s Massive Data Institute, we hosted a new student event.
It was called Petals and Probability, where students from the local area come. And again, it was sort of the event was to predict when the cherry blossoms would bloom. And yeah, that was definitely, right, getting the room, getting the bagel order, getting the pizza order, and, yeah. So yeah, I totally, that that’s been a new perspective that I’ve been gaining some some time with.
Benjamin Nochimson: Yeah, for sure. So, the Washington Statistical Society is just like, like the local chapter of the ASA here. It’s not affiliated with Georgetown?
Patrick Roney: Yeah. So that’s right. So basically, ASA is the national organization and then, right. So WSS, then that’s the local chapter. And so, you know, George Mason, Georgetown, George Washington, University of Maryland, and other universities locally, you know, all are part of it. And then, right, some of our student chapters, [we have] our own flag in that as well.
But again, that’s been an opportunity for us to kind of have within ourselves to be able to have that space, but then, right, get to sort of meet others in the community, and see what else sort of is happening in the statistics profession.
Benjamin Nochimson: Nice. Well, yeah, that’s really cool that you guys have like, you know, a good professional organization like that. Yeah. Having that kind of thing is super important. Definitely community wise. Also just networking and stuff. So yeah, it’s cool that that exists and that you’re a big part of it.
Patrick Roney: Yeah. No, it’s been good. Yeah.
Benjamin Nochimson: So I want to talk also about other research experiences that you’ve had because I saw that you worked for, the Lombardi Cancer Center for a bit, and also the National Heart, Lung, and Blood Institute. And I also saw that you have a pretty impressive, like, array of publications that you’ve had over the years. So are any of those, like, related to each other, like the work that you did at these places and the publications, or is that kind of, like, just separate parts of your career so far?
Patrick Roney: Yeah, yeah. So they’ve definitely, have been connected as far as, yeah. So for instance, when I was like during my master’s program, that was something where I had an internship with National Heart, Lung, and Blood Institute. And so I’d say that that’s one of the things I guess about publishing is that, you know, I did that internship.
That was two years ago. And just last month, you know, we got the acceptance from a journal. So, like, that’s like the tough part as far as you do the work, and then it takes a while before, you know, you get the ultimate payoff. Right? And so, yes, there is always a little bit of something, right, to continue on.
So yeah. So I was able to do that and that was able to lead to a paper and then also with sort of my experience with being a research assistant at Georgetown as well. That’s led to a few papers as well. So that’s what I would say has been really nice, is that, most projects, you know, that we start on, ultimately you want to get to sort of that final goal because I think that’s…it feels good.
I think once you finally get to, you know, you see it up online somewhere and you know, your name is associated with the team and it feels good, again, that you’ve made that contribution. So yeah, we’ve been lucky. I mean, it definitely takes hard work as far as everybody staying on the project, keep pushing it forward. Because research is definitely it’s a team.
It’s a team sport for sure. And so, yeah, I’ve been lucky as far as having people that want to keep pushing all the way to the end. Yeah.
Benjamin Nochimson: Yeah. That’s awesome. So what do you think…what do you think the future holds for you and your career? Obviously, you know, this Ph.D. program is going to be going for, you know, a few more years, obviously. And you already have the, you know, the biostats gig, but what do you, you know, what, are you hoping to get out of this eventually?
Patrick Roney: Yeah. Again, another type of question that I’m trying to still figure out the answer a little bit, but I tell you right now, yeah, I, I, I think there’s a lot of things that I’ve gotten exposed to as far as the things that I like as far as, again, getting to work on really interesting questions and trying to make a good contribution with that.
And also, it’s been fun to be at Georgetown, you know, as far as, you know, I’ve gotten to be here now, I guess three years already. Sorry, the realization’s happening live. But that, you know, it’s it’s a place that, you know, you kind of just…there’s something more to explore, I feel like, all the time, as far as you know, there’s lots of things that are difficult about…that can be difficult right now about being in a place of higher education.
But that’s why I feel like I keep trying to emphasize the fact that it’s sort of the team or it’s the people that you get to do it with that, you know, when I think about sort of whether, for instance, I would work for a private company after Ph.D. or whether I’d be in academia or something that gets to be with the two.
You know, it’s definitely a story of the people that you get to work with. I feel like that’s definitely a big driver of it. So you know, I’d say that a little bit of it, you know, it’d be great to be able to work on sort of clinical trials and being able to, again, work on trying to get improvements in how we get answers efficiently to impact patient outcomes.
I think that would be pretty great. And it’d be really great in my dream world to be able to do that and also be an adjunct professor, because, again, you get a sort of be in private [industry] a little bit. You also get to teach and sort of have your foot in both worlds. So I clearly, like, you know, I like to work and go to school at the same time, hopefully would be able to teach and work at the same time.
And so anyway, we’ll see what the future holds. But that would definitely be a dream scenario to get to have a foot in both worlds.
Benjamin Nochimson: Nice. Well, yeah, I’ll keep my fingers crossed for you. I think it would be cool. It sounds like a really cool, you know, kind of dream career path to go down.
Patrick Roney: Yeah, yeah, it’s been great as far as, like my Washington Statistical Society mentor, she’s also…she works at AstraZeneca. She’s also adjunct at Georgetown. And so getting to sort of hear about her experience, you know, it’s been great to kind of, you know, see other people go down the path that I think would be great to go down.
So yeah, hopefully fingers crossed for the future.
Benjamin Nochimson: Yeah, definitely. And it’s cool that Georgetown I mean I’ve definitely experienced this myself too. But Georgetown brings in just like so many people like that that are just so impressive and so like, oh my goodness – like, I would love to just go down this path or learn from this person. You know?
Patrick Roney: It’s like exactly what you said as far as getting to learn with that person, like, that’s definitely been something that I’ve always appreciated, that there’s, you know, people want to share that information, you know? And again, for some reason it keeps coming back to pizza parties. There’s something about pizza parties at Georgetown that I guess it really brings out sort of the side of right, being able to all just kind of share about people’s experiences and kind of how do you get there and, you know, those informal mentoring opportunities along the way.
So, yeah, it’s been pretty good.
Benjamin Nochimson: Nice. Well, I guess wrapping up here, do you have any advice for future students or maybe even current students? Because, you know, in keeping with this sort of learning from people, some people might want to learn from you also. I think that you’ve had a cool career and path so far. So, any advice?
Patrick Roney: Thanks. Yeah, I think that probably the best piece of advice would come from my first day in my master’s program. I met my academic advisor, and I sat down in there and he said, you know, if you, you know, it’s one of those types of conversation where it’s like, you know, when you take a class, you really have to take it, right?
As far as, you have to take the opportunity to, you know, go to the office hours, go talk to the professor, like, lean into the material. And also then I think that that conversation helped spur me on as far as trying to take advantage of opportunities, and I think more so just ideas that a person can have and just go for it.
And I think that, you know, I think one way that, for instance, that has helped me is, for instance, with just getting to meet other people that are doing great research that, you know, if you read a paper that you really like and then you reach out to them, like people will be happy to respond. And I’ve been able to help with our biostatistics seminar series as far as getting speakers in, just because I read a paper that I think is interesting, send a LinkedIn message or an email, and generally they’ll say, you know, thanks for reaching out.
You know, glad somebody, you know, is reading my work and, you know, they’re you know, everybody at the end of the day is proud of their work. You know, you spend a lot of time on it. Right? And so I think that would be the two things as far as find a project that you want to spend a lot of time on, because it will take a lot of time and it’s always better, I think, to, you know, enjoy the time that you spend on it than not.
So definitely find something that you’re interested in and then also, yeah, I don’t think…don’t ever let yourself stop yourself. And if you’ve got…if you want to reach out to someone, if you want to try out a research idea and you really believe in it, you know, always talk with your advisors and get their opinion too. But also, you know, have faith in yourself. And I think, that’ll be…that would be a good thing to pursue. Yeah.
Benjamin Nochimson: Nice. Well, is there anything else that you think is sort of relevant to what we’ve been talking about that, we haven’t brought up yet that you think would be good to, you know, add in here at the end?
Patrick Roney: Yeah. I think that last question about sums it up as far as, again, find something you like and just keep going.
Benjamin Nochimson: Nice. Well, I really appreciate your time, Patrick. This has been great really, getting to, you know, learn about you and be able to speak to you. And I really appreciate your help with this. We, you know, we’re really excited about this.
Patrick Roney: Yeah. Thanks for having me. I mean, this was this was fun.
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